Problems using My Ooma? Ideas on how we can make it better? You’ve come to the right place.
#59551 by Morpheus
Fri Jul 09, 2010 4:38 am
It seems that Ooma is automatically upgrading its Premier TRIAL subscribers to the monthly Premier tier after their TRIAL period has expired, which I had no idea that would happen.

There is an option to Opt Out while you have a Premier TRIAL subscription, but it is rather confusing because it's stated in such a way that it looks like if you choose to Opt Out you will be Opting Out of the Premier TRIAL.

Why is it that TRIAL subscriptions don't have a Opt In option, and if they fail to Opt In then they are automatically downgraded to BASIC at the end of the TRIAL period. I just happen to catch mine several days before it was to be automatically upgraded to Premier, when I only wanted the BASIC tier.

Leaving a note to support cleared this up and they did send back a verification that my account would be downgraded after the TRIAL period expired.

However, they didn't mention anything about my question as to why we need to Opt Out instead of allowing us Opt In to the Premier tier after the TRIAL had expired.

Didn't AT&T do something similar to this with the 900 sex service line. You actually had to call and block the service, instead of AT&T blocking all the 900 number and making you unblock them.
Last edited by Morpheus on Fri Jul 09, 2010 8:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
#59558 by DTMF
Fri Jul 09, 2010 5:55 am
Morpheus wrote:Why is it that BASIC subscribers have to have a credit card on file. I can see this for Premier customers. As far as I can tell the ONLY thing that could be billed for BASIC customers is International Calling, and can't minutes be pre-purchased on a as needed basis?

Ooma needs to have a way to charge those $11.75 regulatory fees to "BASIC" customers. That's what the credit card is for.

The $10/month that I'm paying Ooma for Premier is buying me more than the $80/month I was paying AT&T for so many years. IMO, it helps ensure that the company will be around longer. Providing free service to everyone and absorbing regulatory fees for everyone was not a sustainable business model.
#59562 by Morpheus
Fri Jul 09, 2010 7:13 am
DTMF wrote:
Morpheus wrote:Why is it that BASIC subscribers have to have a credit card on file. I can see this for Premier customers. As far as I can tell the ONLY thing that could be billed for BASIC customers is International Calling, and can't minutes be pre-purchased on a as needed basis?

Ooma needs to have a way to charge those $11.75 regulatory fees to "BASIC" customers. That's what the credit card is for.

The $10/month that I'm paying Ooma for Premier is buying me more than the $80/month I was paying AT&T for so many years. IMO, it helps ensure that the company will be around longer. Providing free service to everyone and absorbing regulatory fees for everyone was not a sustainable business model.


I have no idea what you could have been paying $80 a month for but that seems a steep in today's economy for any phone service, even Cell service. People get complacent and fail to seek cheaper alternatives. Vonage should have been a better choice over AT&T, and they have been around for years, at less than half that cost.

My Account tells me that the $11.75 regulatory fee doesn't start for 2 years, so there is really no point for them to have my credit card information on file. It just opens up another hole for credit card fraud, when there is no good reason.

So, I'm assuming the Premier tier also has to pay those $11.75 regulatory fees?
#59565 by DTMF
Fri Jul 09, 2010 7:29 am
As it says in my sig, I worked for a VoIP company, so I did my share of dogfooding and had access during that time to as much free VoIP service and international calling as I wanted. ;)

The AT&T line was a necessity because my Internet provider was undependable, my wireless service was prepaid/per-minute and my home security system required an analog phone line for so many years.

Morpheus wrote:My Account tells me that the $11.75 regulatory fee doesn't start for 2 years, so there is really no point for them to have my credit card information on file. It just opens up another hole for credit card fraud, when there is no good reason.

So, I'm assuming the Premier tier also has to pay those $11.75 regulatory fees?

If the fee comes due and the customer doesn't have a card on file to charge it against, eventually Ooma has to either devote some legwork and company resources to hunting the customer down to get them to pay the bill or disconnect the customer. Neither nagging nor disconnection will do anything positive to Ooma's relationship with that customer. This passive requirement to keep a payment method on file is better in that regard.

And yes, we Premier customers are subject to reg fees.
#59575 by Morpheus
Fri Jul 09, 2010 8:31 am
DTMF wrote:As it says in my sig, I worked for a VoIP company, so I did my share of dogfooding and had access during that time to as much free VoIP service and international calling as I wanted. ;)

The AT&T line was a necessity because my Internet provider was undependable, my wireless service was prepaid/per-minute and my home security system required an analog phone line for so many years.

Morpheus wrote:My Account tells me that the $11.75 regulatory fee doesn't start for 2 years, so there is really no point for them to have my credit card information on file. It just opens up another hole for credit card fraud, when there is no good reason.

So, I'm assuming the Premier tier also has to pay those $11.75 regulatory fees?

If the fee comes due and the customer doesn't have a card on file to charge it against, eventually Ooma has to either devote some legwork and company resources to hunting the customer down to get them to pay the bill or disconnect the customer. Neither nagging nor disconnection will do anything positive to Ooma's relationship with that customer. This passive requirement to keep a payment method on file is better in that regard.

And yes, we Premier customers are subject to reg fees.


There will eventually be a problem because CC do expire, so this problem still exists for Ooma. However there is NO way for me to remove CC information. Did we all actually give Ooma permission to bill us for fees outside of what we agreed to when we bought the Telo. I was under the impression that by buying the Telo that our cost were nothing unless we subscribed to the Premier service. Just because it's such a small fee doesn't make it right, unless we were made aware of this upfront. It's possible I was, but I have no recollection of it.

There is no reason why Ooma just could not use snail mail for this, and an email notification for its BASIC subscribers.
#59580 by bw1
Fri Jul 09, 2010 9:15 am
Morpheus wrote:It seems that Ooma is automatically upgrading its Premier TRIAL subscribers to the monthly Premier tier after their TRIAL period has expired, which I had no idea that would happen.

There is an option to Opt Out while you have a Premier TRIAL subscription, but it is rather confusing because it's stated in such a way that it looks like if you choose to Opt Out you will be Opting Out of the Premier TRIAL.

Why is it that TRIAL subscriptions don't have a Opt In option, and if they fail to Opt In then they are automatically downgraded to BASIC at the end of the TRIAL period. I just happen to catch mine several days before it was to be automatically upgraded to Premier, when I only wanted the BASIC tier.

Leaving a note to support cleared this up and they did send back a verification that my account would be downgraded after the TRIAL period expired.

However, they didn't mention anything about my question as to why we need to Opt Out instead of allowing us Opt In to the Premier tier after the TRIAL had expired.

Didn't AT&T do something similar to this with the 900 sex service line. You actually had to call and block the service, instead of AT&T blocking all the 900 number and making you unblock them.


You can opt out at any time during the free trial without affecting the trial (I know from experience).
#59581 by bw1
Fri Jul 09, 2010 9:20 am
Morpheus wrote:There will eventually be a problem because CC do expire, so this problem still exists for Ooma. However there is NO way for me to remove CC information. Did we all actually give Ooma permission to bill us for fees outside of what we agreed to when we bought the Telo. I was under the impression that by buying the Telo that our cost were nothing unless we subscribed to the Premier service. Just because it's such a small fee doesn't make it right, unless we were made aware of this upfront. It's possible I was, but I have no recollection of it.

There is no reason why Ooma just could not use snail mail for this, and an email notification for its BASIC subscribers.


See the TOS, section 8 a.
https://www.ooma.com/legal/terms-and-conditions

(a) In order to purchase Equipment or activate Services from us, you must be at least 18 years old and are required to provide us with a valid email address and a credit or debit card number from a card issuer that we accept ("Issuer"), together with the billing address for the card. We reserve the right to stop accepting credit or debit cards from one or more Issuers. If your credit or debit card expires, you close your account, your billing address changes, or your credit or debit card is cancelled and replaced on account of loss or theft, you must advise us at once and provide new credit or debit card information or we may terminate Service to you. You acknowledge and agree that you authorize us and that we do not need to obtain any additional authorization from you for any recurring payments, automatic billing options or updated credit card or debit card information provided by your credit card or debit card company to us. Your account will be automatically terminated if you put a stop payment on your account with a financial institution in connection with payment of any of your monthly or annual charges.


Actually, you should read all of section 8. Haha, section 8, that's appropriate. :P
#59596 by Morpheus
Fri Jul 09, 2010 10:54 am
bw1 wrote:
Morpheus wrote:It seems that Ooma is automatically upgrading its Premier TRIAL subscribers to the monthly Premier tier after their TRIAL period has expired, which I had no idea that would happen.

There is an option to Opt Out while you have a Premier TRIAL subscription, but it is rather confusing because it's stated in such a way that it looks like if you choose to Opt Out you will be Opting Out of the Premier TRIAL.

Why is it that TRIAL subscriptions don't have a Opt In option, and if they fail to Opt In then they are automatically downgraded to BASIC at the end of the TRIAL period. I just happen to catch mine several days before it was to be automatically upgraded to Premier, when I only wanted the BASIC tier.

Leaving a note to support cleared this up and they did send back a verification that my account would be downgraded after the TRIAL period expired.

However, they didn't mention anything about my question as to why we need to Opt Out instead of allowing us Opt In to the Premier tier after the TRIAL had expired.

Didn't AT&T do something similar to this with the 900 sex service line. You actually had to call and block the service, instead of AT&T blocking all the 900 number and making you unblock them.


You can opt out at any time during the free trial without affecting the trial (I know from experience).


There was an option to Opt Out but it failed to say "After Trial Expires".
#59604 by bw1
Fri Jul 09, 2010 12:15 pm
Morpheus wrote:
bw1 wrote:
Morpheus wrote:It seems that Ooma is automatically upgrading its Premier TRIAL subscribers to the monthly Premier tier after their TRIAL period has expired, which I had no idea that would happen.

There is an option to Opt Out while you have a Premier TRIAL subscription, but it is rather confusing because it's stated in such a way that it looks like if you choose to Opt Out you will be Opting Out of the Premier TRIAL.

Why is it that TRIAL subscriptions don't have a Opt In option, and if they fail to Opt In then they are automatically downgraded to BASIC at the end of the TRIAL period. I just happen to catch mine several days before it was to be automatically upgraded to Premier, when I only wanted the BASIC tier.

Leaving a note to support cleared this up and they did send back a verification that my account would be downgraded after the TRIAL period expired.

However, they didn't mention anything about my question as to why we need to Opt Out instead of allowing us Opt In to the Premier tier after the TRIAL had expired.

Didn't AT&T do something similar to this with the 900 sex service line. You actually had to call and block the service, instead of AT&T blocking all the 900 number and making you unblock them.


You can opt out at any time during the free trial without affecting the trial (I know from experience).


There was an option to Opt Out but it failed to say "After Trial Expires".


I don't have the ability to see what it says anymore, but maybe they can clarify it in their wording.
#59658 by nn5i
Sat Jul 10, 2010 9:18 am
DTMF wrote:
Morpheus wrote:Why is it that BASIC subscribers have to have a credit card on file. I can see this for Premier customers. As far as I can tell the ONLY thing that could be billed for BASIC customers is International Calling, and can't minutes be pre-purchased on a as needed basis?

Ooma needs to have a way to charge those $11.75 regulatory fees to "BASIC" customers. That's what the credit card is for.

The $10/month that I'm paying Ooma for Premier is buying me more than the $80/month I was paying AT&T for so many years. IMO, it helps ensure that the company will be around longer. Providing free service to everyone and absorbing regulatory fees for everyone was not a sustainable business model.


It's nice that you like Premier, but that's not what was asked, is it. He was asking why Ooma has an opt out option instead of an opt in option. That question is asked frequently these days, and recent Federal law makes it mandatory that banks, for example, stop using opt out and use opt in instead.

Why? Because opt out too often results in people spending money they did not intend to spend, and didn't realize they were spending. Opt out is widely considered a kind of scam. Ooma ought to change to opt in.

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