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#23393 by chuckda4th
Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:17 pm
niknak wrote:
...Somebody show me on Amazon's page where it says anything about a # of minutes cap...


Amazon is only the retailer, once you had the unit you would've been expected to read and understand the T&C as outlined on the product's website (and on the printed copy included in the box)
Having done that, if you did not agree to the minutes cap you were free to return the unit


I just checked my box, and there's nothing on it regarding a cap either. If I had purchased it at BestBuy I would have had no idea either. Ooma is intentionally ommitting this information until after you've purchased the product. Once you've purchased there's a clearly lower chance of someone returning something due to one of its deficiencies.

Here's an idea...don't be deceptive about the minutes cap and other terms in the first place, and then maybe I wouldn't have to worry about making extra trips because a company deceived me.
#23396 by chuckda4th
Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:19 pm
niknak wrote:
.. I'm just arguing that it is very deceptive..


it's not deceptive the T&C are printed in black & white on the website and on the paperwork in the box. Don't call the company deceptive if you did not take the time to read and understand everything before hand


Key word...IN the box. Which means I've already purchased it and am less likely to return it.

"Deception (also called beguilement, deceit, bluff, or subterfuge) is the act of convincing another to believe information that is not true, or not the whole truth as in certain types of half-truths."

How is it not deceiving to not find this out until after you've purchased a product?
#23400 by niknak
Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:22 pm
...When you buy a laptop from Amazon, do you go to the manufacturer's website...

yes, i always thouroughly investigate everything before i make a purchase

...there is an expectation that when something says "Free calling in the U.S. with no monthly fees or contracts" there is no cap...


but the product does provide free calling in the US with no monthly fees or contracts...the "cap" was in the fine print that you apparently neglected to read

bottom line, next time read the fine print before you agree to anything
#23403 by chuckda4th
Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:28 pm
niknak wrote:
...When you buy a laptop from Amazon, do you go to the manufacturer's website...

yes, i always thouroughly investigate everything before i make a purchase

...there is an expectation that when something says "Free calling in the U.S. with no monthly fees or contracts" there is no cap...


but the product does provide free calling in the US with no monthly fees or contracts...the "cap" was in the fine print that you apparently neglected to read

bottom line, next time read the fine print before you agree to anything


So if I walk in to Sears and see a lawnmower I like and buy it, you're saying I should have no recourse if I take it home and find out it cant cut any more than 30'x30' a week? My appropriate course of action would have been to drive back home, spend a couple hours scouring Sears' website for terms on the lawnmower, and then and only then have driven back to the Sears to purchase it? This is your process for buying everything in your life?
#23405 by Groundhound
Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:29 pm
chuckda4th wrote:I understand the purpose of it, I'm just arguing that it is very deceptive, and if a company is this deceptive of something as basic as this, what's to stop them from 3 months from now dropping the number to 500 minutes and actually enforcing it?

Competition, pure and simple. Check the T&C of other residential VoIP providers.
#23410 by hpepper
Fri Oct 02, 2009 12:38 pm
Every warranty on anything you buy is sometimes pages long - I don't like having to go through all those - but it's a part of doing business.

I don't see anything wrong with a 5,000 minute limit. Seems reasonable... just like it is reasonable for my ISP to have data limits just to make sure I don't run a large web business out of my house if I am contracting for residential use. I never saw any fine print about that but I know Time Warner has it in there.

No big deal - part of doing business.
#23435 by foxkid
Fri Oct 02, 2009 1:36 pm
I am considering buying OOMA, and have been scouring the web site and reading (nearly) everything in the standard company posts. I haven't yet seen the T&C, but because of this discussion, it is clear that I must find it and read it carefully.
Seems that I may also be signing up at a turbulent time, when the T&C's are changing.
5000 minutes seems like a lot, until you consider a teenage son + wife who lifes on the phone.
#23439 by niknak
Fri Oct 02, 2009 1:41 pm
ooma has never restricted anyone from using the phone for residential use..as has been mentioned before it is a legal condition to prevent commercial abuse, as such it is a non-issue for all legitimate users
#23452 by foxkid
Fri Oct 02, 2009 2:04 pm
Thanks niknak. That is probably a condition we could live with.

I don't have Verizon FIOS because of their T&Cs, even through they might never be enforced. The 5000 minute definition of "unlimited" is less severe.
#23476 by Dennis P
Fri Oct 02, 2009 3:09 pm
We have tried to refrain from using the the phrase "unlimited calling" for quite some time now (we say "free calling" now). We have purged any mention on it on our packaging, website and our retail partners. If we have missed any place, let us know.

It is very common in the telephony market for companies to use the word unlimited, but in virtually all cases, "unlimited" is subject to the definition and interpretation of the provider. We've tried to avoid playing that game by shifting away from the term.

The terms and conditions are in place to protect us from abuse. If you are using the product for residential use, you have nothing to be concerned about. It's unfortunate that a small cadre of customers has to ruin the fun for everyone, but that happens in all walks of life, doesn't it?

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