Having trouble placing or receiving calls or using your voicemail system on Ooma Telo VoIP Phones? Post your questions here.
#97871 by rocksockdoc
Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:04 pm
I'm on a typical wireless ISP (aka WISP) setup for which Ooma works fine; but every time I ask for help from anyone working for Ooma, they don't know what WISP is so they give me bad advice.

My question in this thread is simply this:
Q: Where can i get Ooma support (written or verbal) that actually knows what WISP is?

Here's a typical scenario, so far, when I ask a basic support question for setting QoS on my Ooma:
a) They first ask me where my modem is, and I tell them there is no modem.
b) They then ask if my modem is integral with my router, and I repeat that there is no modem.
c) They they ask if my service is DSL or cable or fiber optics, which I tell them it is not any of those, it's WISP.
d) Then they say they don't support satellite, which I tell them WISP is nothing at all even remotely like satellite.
e) Then they invariably give up because they're just not trained in what WISP fundamentally is.

I haven't yet found a single Ooma support page that discusses WISP setup. I should add that my Ooma works just fine but I would like to improve the voice call quality.

Testing with http://speedtest.net and http://www.phonepower.com/speedtest reveals I have measured download speeds of about 6.43 Mbps and upload speeds of about 3.98 Mbps with ping times of about 9ms and jitter between me and the server of 8.2ms and jitter between the server and me of 2.1ms and an estimated mean opinion score (aka MOS score) of 4 (which is about cell phone quality).

At the moment, I'm trying to figure out WHERE to set the QoS to improve voice quality.

I've been told that modem-ooma-router situations set QoS at the Ooma Setup Advanced tab while modem-router-modem situations set QoS set in the broadband router.

But ... (and this is the main point) ... this is a Wireless ISP (WISP) situation.

There is no modem! I repeat. There is no modem. There is just an antenna on the roof which has a radio and router, then a broadband router inside the house and then the ooma dongle connected to the Ooma.

So, the main question I'm trying to find the answer to is: WHERE do I set QoS for a typical WISP situation such as mine?

The problem with getting the answer is that nobody at Ooma I've ever spoken to even knows how to 'spell' WISP, let alone understands that it is.

They tell me: "We only support dsl, cable and fiber-optics connection. Wireless connection is not supported.:
And I explain, this is a wired connection at the house!

Then they always say: I'm sorry but we do not recommend satellite internet connection because this causes call quality issues such as dropped calls and choppy line. And we cannot troubleshoot these types of concerns.
And I explain, this isn't even remotely similar to satellite!

Then they ask the key question: So is your Internet considered as dsl, cable or as a fiber-optics connection?
For this, I don't know the answer.

A typical DSL or cable setup, for example, would be:
cable or dsl --> modem --> broadband router --> Ooma dongle
or
cable or dsl --> modem --> Ooma --> broadband router

My situation is similar, but there is no modem.

A typical WISP setup, for example, would be:
rooftop antenna --> rooftop radio/router --> home broadband router --> Ooma dongle
or
rooftop antenna --> rooftop radio/router --> Ooma --> home broadband router

It 'seems' to me (and I'm guessing), WISP is no different than cable/dsl/fiberoptic, once it enters the house. It's simply a wired connection at the house that I can plug directly into any computer or into any home broadband router. So, to me, it's no different than cable, dsl, or fiber optics EXCEPT there is no modem.

But, I could be wrong. That's why I'm looking for someone (anyone) at Ooma who knows how to spell WISP.

So, very frustrated, may I ask if anyone out there is familiar with WISP who knows WHERE in Oomaland I can find someone or some page that actually says how to handle QoS on a typical WISP setup?
#97873 by lbmofo
Mon Jul 16, 2012 11:24 pm
rooftop antenna --> rooftop radio/router --> home broadband router --> Ooma dongle

In this case, make sure everything connecting to internet connects via "home broadband router" and set QoS in "home boradband router." Have "home boradband router" give Ooma the highest priority.

rooftop antenna --> rooftop radio/router --> Ooma --> home broadband router

In this case, also make sure everything connecting to internet connects via "home broadband router" and set QoS in Ooma. Since Ooma is ahead of everything that can connect to internet, Ooma can reserve bandwidth it needs on its own.

/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=13928&start=20#p97872
#97874 by murphy
Tue Jul 17, 2012 2:12 am
For what it is worth the "radio/router" has to be a modem. Modem is short for modulator demodulator. An incoming radio signal must be demodulated to convert it to a digital stream. An outgoing digital stream must modulate an RF carrier to transmit it as a radio signal.

An incoming signal on cable is a radio frequency signal that must be tuned in via a receiver and then demodulated.

The only difference between radio and cable is the medium. Cable is much more efficient that over the air so the required transmitter power level and receiver sensitivity can be much lower.

For the purposes of setting QOS there is no difference between over the air and cable.
If Ooma is in front of your router QOS is configured in Ooma. If Ooma is behind your router QOS is configured in the router and disabled (set to 0) in the OOMA.
#97885 by rocksockdoc
Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am
I'll cut and paste my 'revelation' from the other thread for reference:
How to improve WISP Ooma call quality on a Linksys WRT54G?

murphy wrote:It is not possible to transmit data over radio with out modulating and demodulating the RF carrier.


Very true.

murphy wrote:The shorthand term for modulate and demodulate is modem.


Ah. I see where you're going. I call the 'radio' a tranceiver ... but what you're saying is that it can also be considered a modulator/demodulator (aka a modem). This makes sense.

murphy wrote:ALL wireless computers include a modem as part of the transmitter/receiver circuitry.
It's all combined in a specialized integrated circuit but all of the functions have to be there.


Thanks! You clarified my dilemma nicely in that thread when you said:

murphy wrote:the "radio/router" has to be a modem. ... The only difference between radio and cable is the medium. Cable ... and over the air


And, here's the best part yet for clarifying the difference between the transceiver and the modem setups:

murphy wrote:For the purposes of setting QOS there is no difference between over the air and cable.
If Ooma is in front of your [home broadband router] QOS is configured in Ooma. If Ooma is behind your [home broadband router] QOS is configured in the [broadband] router and disabled (set to 0) in the OOMA.


Note: By its very nature, WISP has two potential routers because the radio transceiver itself can be set up as a bridge (no router) or, more likely, as a router (to protect the ISP), with or without concurrent NAT & DNS. A typical WISP setup would be for the radio transceiver to be set up as a router but with NAT and DNS turned off. So there are two routers in the equation.

Now it all makes sense. Here's my summary based on your excellent description above:
1. All WISP setups have a transceiver (i.e., radio) at (or extremely close to) the antenna
[Note: The transceiver is almost always at the antenna to reduce RF losses!]

2. This radio transceiver can be considered as a 'modem' for the purpose of determining the QoS algorithm.
[Note: This concept of equating the rooftop radio "transceiver" with a "modem" was my critical stumbling block!]

3. Given that, the QoS setup algorithm is one of the following:
A) antenna/transceiver/router ==> home broadband router --> Ooma dongle
lbmofo wrote:In this case, make sure everything connecting to internet connects via the "home broadband router" and therefore set QoS in the "home broadband router." so that the "home boradband router" gives Ooma the highest priority.


B) antenna/transceiver/router ==> Ooma ==> home broadband router
lbmofo wrote:In this case, also make sure everything connecting to internet connects via the "home broadband router" and set the QoS in the Ooma. Since Ooma is ahead of everything that can connect to the Internet, Ooma can reserve the bandwidth it needs on its own.


Sorry for being thick and getting all hung up on the word 'modem'! All I need to do is substitute 'radio transceiver' for 'modem' and then I can follow all the existing advice! Thanks for being patient with me and sticking with me to a resolution!
#97888 by thunderbird
Tue Jul 17, 2012 11:04 am
rocksockdoc:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireless_I ... e_provider
WISP = Wireless Internet service provider

It's only a question of Semantics.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transceiver
A modem is similar to a transceiver, in that it sends and receives a signal, but a modem uses modulation and demodulation. It modulates a signal being transmitted and demodulates a signal being received.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modem
When broadband technology was introduced, networking and routers were unfamiliar to consumers. However, many people knew what a modem was as most internet access was through dial-up. Due to this familiarity, companies started selling broadband modems using the familiar term modem rather than vaguer ones like adapter or transceiver, or even "bridge".

http://www.trificient.net/wisp.html .
Each user of wireless ISP is provided with a small transceiver (transmitting and receiving device) that is mounted on their house or building. The transceiver is connected to the user computing system via a wire and interface card. No modem is required. The user accesses the Internet through their “browser” of choice (Netscape, Microsoft Explorer, etc.).


In this case when ever you see a reference to "Modem" in the Ooma Fourm Text or from Customer Service, subsiture "Transceiver" (transmitting and receiving device).

There are several people that very successfully use Wireless Data lines, to provide an Internet signal to their Ooma device, in locations where they are not provided with Wired Internet service.

Often times the Wireless jitter is higher With Wireless.
The suggested Jitter should be less then 5ms to and from the Internet provider.
There must be no lost packets, packet discards or packets out of order.
#98216 by rocksockdoc
Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:01 am
Longer term update.

I've worked with Ooma support a few more times, and all I do now, thanks to you, is substitute 'modem' for 'radio' when they ask how I'm set up. It works much better that way ... without confusion. By making that simple word substitution, I no longer get the (incorrect) obligatory dismissal "we don't support satellite" (which I don't have anyway) - and that saves me five or ten minutes explaining what WISP is to the support personnel. Since NONE of them know what WISP is, I must assume I'm in the vast minority when it comes to using Ooma on broadband WISP (i.e., 5 to 10 MBps symmetric).

Thanks for helping me understand!

SUMMARY:
My radio is the same as your modem; the main difference is the INPUT to my radio is wireless while the input to your modem is wired. That's about the only practical difference.

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