This forum includes tips for maintaining the best audio quality possible with the Ooma System. If your Ooma system is having issues with dropped calls, static audio or echo, look here for assistance.
#81472 by marcaronson408
Sun May 15, 2011 11:09 am
horsecore wrote:If you don't mind doing it, please keep us posted on the status/progress of your ticket Marc.

I'll provide periodic updates -- I remain optimistic that the OOMA crew will solve the problem, but only time will tell. In the meantime you might want to try an OBI100 or IBI110 as an alternative to some of the other companies your identified. This hardware will let you work with any of several VOIP service providers.

Marc
#81486 by vicw
Sun May 15, 2011 2:31 pm
marcaronson408 wrote:...The difference is startling....


You wrote a nicely detailed post, but I don't quite understand the meaning of this portion of it. The difference between what and what is startling? Could you elaborate a bit?
Last edited by vicw on Sun May 15, 2011 2:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
#81487 by vicw
Sun May 15, 2011 2:41 pm
@thunderbird

As a followup to your suggestions, I tried moving the Telo as far away as I could from any other devices. It didn't make any apparent difference.

I actually had to order a corded phone from Amazon for that testing that you recommended, and I'll try it as soon as it arrives. I remain very skeptical about either the Telo placement or the wireless phones being a contributor to this problem, but I'm willing to try anything within reason.

I did note that as a comparison to the Ooma path, when I used my laptop and the phone function in gmail to call the 909 number, the echo delay was virtually imperceptible.

I also have a question about how much echo delay is acceptable or normal? I know that performance is poor with the 600+ms echo time, but what constitutes good timing?
#81497 by marcaronson408
Sun May 15, 2011 6:00 pm
vicw wrote:
marcaronson408 wrote:...The difference is startling....


You wrote a nicely detailed post, but I don't quite understand the meaning of this portion of it. The difference between what and what is startling? Could you elaborate a bit?


I can see how the way I wrote it up would cause confusion. I was referring to the extreme difference in the lag times:

OOMA via HUB: 725MS
OOMA via Scout: 850MS
Google Voice(GV): 450MS
#81499 by paladin252
Mon May 16, 2011 5:05 am
i have noticed that all of my fellow one communications customers are having quite bad delay. is there something we can do by contacting one communications or do we ask ooma to do it for us? i love my ooma but my obi110 has such a better handle on delay, makes me consider switching.
#81510 by thunderbird
Mon May 16, 2011 11:58 am
vicw wrote:I also have a question about how much echo delay is acceptable or normal? I know that performance is poor with the 600+ms echo time, but what constitutes good timing?

Vicw: I certainly didn't expect you or anyone else to buy a corded phone just for testing.
Serviceable VoIP can have up to 400 milliseconds of delay.

Delay for a small group of Ooma customers seems to be Ooma's overall greatest phone service problem. The delay problem just continues and continues.

It’s strange that most Ooma customers don't have any noticeable delay at all, ever, and others do.

If Ooma could cure their delay problems, Ooma would have "The World By The Tail". It would certainly be easy to sell more Oomas. We the customers would sell the Ooma products.

I know a while back when Ooma had all of the I/they can't hear you/me problems, there was a huge out-cry from Ooma customers, which finally prodded Ooma to make corrections.
#81511 by vicw
Mon May 16, 2011 1:22 pm
thunderbird wrote:
vicw wrote:I also have a question about how much echo delay is acceptable or normal? I know that performance is poor with the 600+ms echo time, but what constitutes good timing?

Vicw: I certainly didn't expect you or anyone else to buy a corded phone just for testing.
Serviceable VoIP can have up to 400 milliseconds of delay.

Delay for a small group of Ooma customers seems to be Ooma's overall greatest phone service problem. The delay problem just continues and continues.

It’s strange that most Ooma customers don't have any noticeable delay at all, ever, and others do.

If Ooma could cure their delay problems, Ooma would have "The World By The Tail". It would certainly be easy to sell more Oomas. We the customers would sell the Ooma products.

I know a while back when Ooma had all of the I/they can't hear you/me problems, there was a huge out-cry from Ooma customers, which finally prodded Ooma to make corrections.


No problem with the phone purchase. It was just $10.50 with no shipping from Amazon. I was just tweaking you a bit.

It came today, and I tested the RT delay using Audacity on my laptop to both the (909) and the (925) echo numbers under normal conditions, and then with the cordless phones powered off, and with the shiny new AT&T corded phone plugged directly into the Telo.

Nominal RT delays were:
Normal configuration
(909) - 860ms
(925) - 350ms

Wired Phone directly into Telo, all cordless phones OFF
(909) - 840ms
(925) - 320ms

I reran the measurements after rebooting the Telo, with no significant difference in the delay, so neither relocating the Telo or using a hardwired phone made any meaningful difference in performance.

It seems to me that the variation in delays probably represents typical real world variations using Ooma, and I really believe that the problems are very likely network caused, not due to defective Telos, but I'm willing to try another one. I will be quite skeptical about the likelihood of success with a swap-out, but I don't have too many options left. I've made every setting in accordance with instructions and comments on this forum. I dread writing a ticket on this, as I anticipate a new round of busy work for me before Ooma would offer a replacement unit.

I wonder about your comment that only a few Ooma customers have a noticeable delay. I suppose there will be variations in network performance due to the variety of servers, and locations, but I expect many customers have the delay without ever understanding what it means, and don't have the geek skills or the spare time to actually measure the delays. Also, some users will tolerate it better than others.

I can cope with it, but it is annoying to have to pause to make sure the person on the other end is really finished, or isn't about to start a new comment. On the other hand, it is driving my wife and her friends bonkers, and she is becoming more and more frustrated with it. I really do not want to have to go back to TWC if I can avoid it, but we never experienced this kind of problem with their VOIP service. I'm guessing it might be because they control their network infrastructure, at least I think they do, so they can provide some consistency in performance.
#81512 by jhphone
Mon May 16, 2011 1:46 pm
thunderbird wrote:
vicw wrote:I also have a question about how much echo delay is acceptable or normal? I know that performance is poor with the 600+ms echo time, but what constitutes good timing?

Vicw: I certainly didn't expect you or anyone else to buy a corded phone just for testing.
Serviceable VoIP can have up to 400 milliseconds of delay.

Delay for a small group of Ooma customers seems to be Ooma's overall greatest phone service problem. The delay problem just continues and continues.

It’s strange that most Ooma customers don't have any noticeable delay at all, ever, and others do.

If Ooma could cure their delay problems, Ooma would have "The World By The Tail". It would certainly be easy to sell more Oomas. We the customers would sell the Ooma products.

I know a while back when Ooma had all of the I/they can't hear you/me problems, there was a huge out-cry from Ooma customers, which finally prodded Ooma to make corrections.


I cannot agree more strongly with the points you make above. If Ooma fixed these issues I would be more than pleased. If not, then the opposite reaction.

It is very strange that this delay problem affects only some customers and not others. (I believe we are all being honest here about our experiences.)

But another significant aspect of the delay problem that some of us experience is that we occasionally have NO noticeable delay. This has happened for me with some cell and international calls, also reported here by others.

What this tells me is that the cause of the delay is absolutely NOT in my equipment.

First, there is the total inability of my wired Western Electric phone to buffer audio. It's impossible. It CANNOT cause any delay.

Furthermore, there is the fact that the amount of delay is generally dependent on the external nature of the call: land line, cell, international, etc. External means Ooma and whatever their system connects to.

I think we must all realize that a wired WE phone -- even if it could impossibly buffer audio -- cannot somehow figure out that "Hey, there is a cell phone on the other end, so I'll stop buffering."

An in-house phone does not "know" the type of connection and therefore cannot change its behavior based on (unknown to it) the connection type. It's just a STUPID PHONE!

Furthermore yet, there is an ongoing randomness in the amount of delay that does NOT honor the rules mentioned above. IOW, whether the call is international, cell, local land line, or long distance landline, the delay in NOT PREDICTABLE. Sometimes bad. Sometimes OK.

The only component that could possibly exhibit this RANDOM behavior is a system far more complex than a wired or cordless phone. That means: Ooma equipment, software, and other connected telco systems, etc. etc. etc.

Please, please, PLEASE! Stop blaming this call-delay problem on user's equipment.


IT'S NOT USER EQUIPMENT!
#81513 by thunderbird
Mon May 16, 2011 2:02 pm
Repost: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9569&p=67874&hilit=Audacity#p67874
By Bobby B » Fri Oct 29, 2010 9:07 pm
For those users experiencing high delay during calls, it'd help us if you could measure how much delay you've been experiencing. Measuring this delay is somewhat technical - but it'd definitely help us further troubleshoot this problem.

Here's how to measure your delay:
1. Open a sound recording program on your computer. A free one that you can download is Audacity.
2. After verifying that your attached or built-in microphone is working, press the record button.
3. Bring your phone next your microphone or laptop, and dial test number 909-390-0003 (& 925-259-0082 Added) using the speakerphone on your phone.
4. Speak a short word like "one" - you'll see the microphone pick up your word and the echo response.
5. Stop the recording, and then highlight the waveforms that contain your word and the echo response. Click the magnifying glass to zoom in on the area and give you a more precise timeline measurement.
6. Afterwards, measure between the start of the your word and the echo response. To make this measurement easier, you may delete any audio that was recorded prior to your word, so that time "0.00" aligns with the start of your word.
sb06794 wrote:One very minor suggestion for testing the Ooma audio delay: Instead of speaking a word like "one", use one quick tap on the phone with a pencil. It makes a much sharper spike making it easier to measure the delay. FYI - Our delay is typically 850 msec using the 909-390-0003 echo number. We live in Ithaca, New York.
Stu

vicw wrote:Nominal RT delays were:
Normal configuration
(909) - 860ms
(925) - 350ms

Wired Phone directly into Telo, all cordless phones OFF
(909) - 840ms
(925) - 320ms


Qote Bill D:
909-390-0003 is outside of Ooma and can be called by any phone (Ooma or not) to test round-trip delay.
925-259-0082 is inside of Ooma and tests round-trip delay without going out of Ooma over a carrier.

By Thunderbird
You would think that the difference between the inside the Ooma system call times and the outside the Ooma system calls, is pointing the delay problem to Ooma's Gateway Servers, the Wholesaler, or the Legacy Carrier.

But still if as I've read, the Home Ooma device chooses the routes, etc. the Ooma device could be defective?

Keeping after Ooma Customer Service daily is probably the best approach.
Last edited by thunderbird on Mon May 16, 2011 3:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
#81516 by EA PA
Mon May 16, 2011 2:28 pm
thunderbird wrote: I know a while back when Ooma had all of the I/they can't hear you/me problems, there was a huge out-cry from Ooma customers, which finally prodded Ooma to make corrections.


I reiterate that I have definitely seen an improvement in the issue referred to above. In fact, I have had very few disconnects and no delay to connect to cell phones in weeks. More importantly, I get no more complaints from my bride. :D . You may be correct! The high visibility seems to have helped OOMA along.

On delay, I had measured ~ 750 ms (reported previously) on the outside OOMA number, but frankly I have not noticed it much during calls. I wonder if the delay has changed since the last deployment of code. Ill test again and repost when I get a chance.

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